Sometimes I Wish the Rapture would Happen just so I could be Free from the Idiots

Just being sarcastic CG. I would assume that there would not be spirits risng up in the sky also.

But considering there is very little in the bible that really mentions a rapture at all I tend not to hold onto that idea.

Well there had to be some serious circumstance or event that has caused you to be so bitter and resentful to the RCC.

Well there had to be some serious circumstance or event that has caused you to be so bitter and resentful to the RCC.

Maybe the tens of thousands of child rape cases and the subsequent cover-up? I know that would do it for me.

Maybe the tens of thousands of child rape cases and the subsequent cover-up? I know that would do it for me.

Tens of thousands? Your number is a bit overzealous.

Need there be more of a reason for you ??

No, I don't think so. I've read quite enough of your rants. As my grandfather once said: "There's no reasoning with unreasonable people"

Tens of thousands? Your number is a bit overzealous.

No. There are over 20,000 in the dutch churches alone. That doesn't count the rest of the world. It's right on the mark.

I could also add to CG's list things like the cultural genocide of Native Americans in Catholic boarding schools where they systematically tried to wipe their culture out while raping them on a consistent basis. Do you need more examples of the evil that is the Catholic Church?

No, I don't think so. I've read quite enough of your rants. As my grandfather once said: "There's no reasoning with unreasonable people"

In other words you have nothing to refute his arguments so you throw out a saying and try to label him 'unreasonable' so you don't have to actually face the charges made.

Maybe your grandfather was talking about you when he said that.

Or once when I was telling this guy that god used evolution to create man replied, "won't have an intellectual dual with a guy who is unarmed". That was funny.

No. There are over 20,000 in the dutch churches alone. That doesn't count the rest of the world. It's right on the mark.

I'm certain that your have supporting evidence for your assertions.

I'm certain that your have supporting evidence for your assertions.

Of course: http://grisham.newsvine.com/_news/2011/12/17/9527147-mass-cases-of-sex-abuse-in-dutch-churches

The article states: The report spans from the period between 1945 to 2010, and says "the scale" of the abuse "is relatively small in percentage terms, but is a serious problem in absolute numbers." Say what? Give us the numbers.

What's also buried in the story is: "...Christian Democrat leader said it could identify 800 Catholic clergy and other church employees guilty of sexually abusing..." That means not every accused is clergy and they conveniently leave out the breakdown between clergy and employees.

I noticed a related article directly under it, topic: sexual abuse in the United Methodist Church. You better start your next pogrom against them

You asked me what some of my reasons were. I told you. Can you dispute what I've said ??

Yet those same organizations helped Nazis to escape,

Yes that's the legend...and it's regrettable if true. So you blame the whole body for the shortcomings of a Pope who commanded no army and had no influence on events of the time? Do you mention the priests and nuns and their parishioners all across 1940's Europe who put their lives at risk sheltering Jews from the SS? (And after the war from the Russians)

...permit the molestation of children while hiding or moving the sick bastards that do the evil while in the employ of their organization.

Yes there were abuses, yes it was wrong to deny that abuses happened and yes it was wrong protect the guilty. There is NO organization on Earth where every member is as pure as the wind driven snow. I attended Catholic schools for 12 years, was an altar boy, and participated in many Church/school activities, I had priests as teachers, many of those priests had the opportunity of "access" to me. Never once was I approached by any of them at any time under any circumstance.

Implemented the inquisition to convert people or kill them,...

Yes, something that happened 700 years ago. The people involved and their victims are dead and gone...can we move on?

...and telling people their beliefs were the only valid beliefs.

And you don't sound like that too?

Paying money to be set free from sins does not help you,...

Indulgences were back in the 16th century. I give money to the Church to support its mission here on Earth, I don't expect anything in return.

Praying to Mary the mother of Christ is an insult to God, Christ and The Holy Spirit,...

It's not praying to her, it's asking her to pray to the Holy Trinity on our behalf. How many times have you been asked by friends or neighbors to keep someone in your prayers?

You don't have to confess to a priest, you can go directly to Jesus Christ.

The priest is Christ's ordained representative on earth.

Saying hail Mary's may help in a football game if you are calling for a pass play, but as a repentance of sin it is more sin.

The Hail Mary is not the prayer for repentance. The Catholic prayer for repentance, the Act of Contrition, makes no reference to Mary.

You should be ashamed of yourself for excusing pedophilia because of your faith. They not only raped the children, but moved them around so they could have fresh grounds to prey on more children. They pay off the victims with your money and protect them from the law so they don't face justice.

It's dirty and religious people should be screaming bloody murder until something is done about it. Not justifying it like you're doing.

— As many as 20,000 children endured sexual abuse at Dutch Catholic institutions over the past 65 years, and church officials failed to adequately address it or help the victims, according to a long-awaited investigative report released Friday.

The findings detailed some of the most widespread abuse yet linked to the Roman Catholic Church, which has been under fire for years over abuse allegations in Europe, the United States and elsewhere.

Based on a survey of 34,000 people, the report estimated that 1 in 10 Dutch children suffered some form of sexual abuse — a figure that rose to 1 in 5 among children who spent part of their youth in an institution such as a boarding school or children's home, whether Catholic or not.

http://www.newsvine.com/_news/2011/12/16/9488457-report-slams-dutch-catholic-church-over-sex-abuse

And again, that's in one small part of the world. This abuse goes around the world. It's not a pogrom. It's truth that you don't want to face.

You asked me what some of my reasons were. I told you. Can you dispute what I've said ??

Yet those same organizations helped Nazis to escape,

Yes that's the legend...and it's regrettable if true. So you blame the whole body for the shortcomings of a Pope who commanded no army and had no influence on events of the time? Do you mention the priests and nuns and their parishioners all across 1940's Europe who put their lives at risk sheltering Jews from the SS? (And after the war from the Russians)

...permit the molestation of children while hiding or moving the sick bastards that do the evil while in the employ of their organization.

Yes there were abuses, yes it was wrong to deny that abuses happened and yes it was wrong protect the guilty. There is NO organization on Earth where every member is as pure as the wind driven snow. I attended Catholic schools for 12 years, was an altar boy, and participated in many Church/school activities, I had priests as teachers, many of those priests had the opportunity of "access" to me. Never once was I approached by any of them at any time under any circumstance.

Implemented the inquisition to convert people or kill them,...

Yes, something that happened 700 years ago. The people involved and their victims are dead and gone...can we move on?

...and telling people their beliefs were the only valid beliefs.

And you don't sound like that too?

Paying money to be set free from sins does not help you,...

Indulgences were back in the 16th century. I give money to the Church to support its mission here on Earth, I don't expect anything in return.

Praying to Mary the mother of Christ is an insult to God, Christ and The Holy Spirit,...

It's not praying to her, it's asking her to pray to the Holy Trinity on our behalf. How many times have you been asked by friends or neighbors to keep someone in your prayers?

You don't have to confess to a priest, you can go directly to Jesus Christ.

The priest is Christ's ordained representative on earth.

Saying hail Mary's may help in a football game if you are calling for a pass play, but as a repentance of sin it is more sin.

The Hail Mary is not the prayer for repentance. The Catholic prayer for repentance, the Act of Contrition, makes no reference to Mary.

You should be ashamed of yourself for excusing pedophilia because of your faith.

I didn't excuse it. And you should be ashamed of yourself for slinging mud at the dedicated clergy who joined the vocation to serve God, not for the purposes you describe.

The very fact that the history of the church doesn't bother you speaks volumes about being able to compartmentalize things.

Show me one institution, organization, government composed of and run by human beings that is perfect. You wholesale condemn an entire organization top down...from the Pope to the people who sit in the pews. You refuse recognize the possibility that you may be wrong and that the Church has good people serving God throughout the world.

The priests are not Christ's ordained representatives on earth unless you are claiming that Christ allowed them to molest the children !!! What is it that you have said ?? That they are allowed in the Name of Christ forgive or condemn ?? To molest and destroy in His Name ??

The question is never, ever asked as to what was the motivation of the molestors to become clergy? Service to God probably isn't even 9th or 10th on their list. How many of these types went in with the intent and purpose to find a backdoor way to do just this? How does the Church vet against such candidates when duplicity, secrecy and stealth are their main attributes? Or are you saying they are "turned" in the seminary to behave this way? We see these abuses by clergy of other denominations, camp counselors, daycare workers, educational administrators and faculty, doctors, sports coaches, uncles, cousins, cops and neighbors. That doesn't count in your worldview. Your obsessive and visceral hatred toward everything Catholic blinds you to all of this

That they are allowed in the Name of Christ forgive or condemn ??

Matthew 18:18. But it looks like you want apply for the job as well.

I don't ask the dead to pray for the living. I pray to the living Christ for those in His need.

You're free to do as you wish; as am I.

I'm responsible for what I do, and believe in. I have His peace right now.

Romans 2:1.

You may have His peace but you don't have His acquiesence to judge and condemn a whole denomination by the actions of some of its clergy.

I agree with you. They all say "well... you're gay and thats wrong! Never mind my 3 divorces, I'm still going to heaven"

When in reality nobody truly "knows" whether they will go to heaven or not. Someone could think they are the best thing given to man kind, when in reality they are not.

Maybe someday I will consider dusting off my good book again. But I think its better to strive to be a good person, fully and completely, just without the church. Maybe once I feel content in that, I will hear something and be in a better place to listen.

Hi cowboygrandpa that's good for you. I have respect for those that can walk the walk and I would think if someone really believes instead of just says it, their behavior will improve. It's my observation that's not what I see most of the time. And anyone that knows me knows I'd never mock someone for being a Christian.

If I walked into a car tech's shop and saw the cross and other evidence the owner was Christian, I'd feel like my chances of getting ripped off are high and about even with someone that's not. The Christian community needs to get better at that - I really think if they created a group that clearly behaved better, people would want to take part in it and the impetus to believe would make a whole lot more sense.

I wish you could meet my mechanic. He's one of those Christians you can't miss. No cross or Jesus save logo, but definitely a Christian and a great mechanic.

I was a conservative when I was younger and became more liberal as I became more involved with Christ.

I never understood how someone could stand as a harsh republican and claim that they were doing god's work.

Deny women rights, deny gays rights, support war, support the rich, step on the poor, hate muslims, think every muslim is a terrorist.

But they sit in the pews and talk the talk... I just don't get it.